| Change log entry 69011 | |
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| Processed by: | richwarm (2020-01-29 21:50:01 UTC) |
| Comment: |
<< review queue entry 65395 - submitted by 'sl89' >> I see two different different meanings for 冬菇 in different sources, never both on the same source: 1) Any kind of mushroom (菇类 — not a specific species) gathered or produced in the winter. MoE mentions “香菇、洋菇、草菇”, etc. all can be 冬菇. (Pleco; GF; MoE; LAC. ABC's “winter mushrooms” also points in this direction). 2) Synonym for 香菇, shiitake (百度百科，Wikipedia, 现代汉语大词典). * If the first meaning is right, the current definition isn't, it's not just Shiitake mushrooms that are 冬菇; if the second is right, the current definition still isn't right, it's not just "a grade". * Maybe both are right; and since I can't be sure I'm submitting both. * The Baidu Baike article indicates the name 冬菇 for 香菇 may be a Guangdong regionalism (“广东人一般都叫它做冬菇，其它省份的人叫它做香菇”). * ABC and Pleco say 冬菇 are dried, I haven't seen this on any other definition, but it seems to be sometimes translated as such. 【Wenlin】 n. dried winter mushrooms 【Pleco】 NOUN dried mushrooms (picked in winter) 【LAC】 冬季生产、采收的菇类。富含蛋白质及多种人体必需微量元素。 【MoE】 泛指在冬季生产、采收的菇类。包括香菇、洋菇、草菇等。如：「在台湾，香菇的产期为一年四季均有，但冬菇产量较少。」 【规范】 名 冬季采摘的香菇。 【现代汉语大词典】 即香菇。 【Wikipedia：香菇】 香菇（学名：Lentinula edodes）又叫做冬菇、北菇、香蕈、厚菇、薄菇、花菇、椎茸，为小皮伞科香菇属的物种，是一种食用菇类。 https://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E9%A6%99%E8%8F%87 [冬菇 redirects to 香菇] 【百度百科】 又名香菇。冬菇规格严整，等级分明。分为花菇、厚菇、薄菇3等11级。冬菇含有丰富的蛋白质和多种人体必需的微量元素。 [...] 冬菇是香港人很喜爱的副食品，广东人一般都叫它做冬菇，其它省份的人叫它做香菇。香菇，又称复蕈、香菌，是世界著名的食用菇菌，在蘑菇中数香菇的食用价值和食疗价值最高。 https://baike.baidu.com/item/%E5%86%AC%E8%8F%87/5897553 大冬菇五朵 5 large Chinese dried black mushrooms (shiitake) https://www.taiwan-panorama.com/Articles/Details?Guid=4d8a5ef2-0724-4f12-87bf-8cf39beeccd7&CatId=1 冬菇2朵 2 black mushrooms https://www.taiwan-panorama.com/Articles/Details?Guid=e15d1e54-7164-4947-8c8f-76cff08e8772&CatId=1 冬菇6朵 6 Chinese black mushrooms https://www.taiwan-panorama.com/Articles/Details?Guid=d021c8c5-7219-43e1-9395-f7d9c8071a48&CatId=1 向晚時分，雲霧四起的小鎮仍有人在奔走，只見市街這頭，盤商的貨車正逐戶詢價收購剛出爐的乾香菇，沉睡中的空蕩菇舍也可能突然亮起，原來上萬包剛接種完、從附近「太空包製造廠」送來的太空包準備入庫，眾人合力鋪排一番，接著就是漫長的養菌期──菌絲要花4個月才能「走」遍整包培養土，屆時俗名「黑早」的高品質冬菇，又將成為菇農們一日三顧、又愛又恨的麻煩寶貝。 In the evening, the dormant, empty mushroom sheds suddenly light up. Tens of thousands of freshly inoculated "growing bags" from nearby manufacturers have arrived. Everybody works together storing them in neat rows. Now comes the long incubation period: the mycelia take about four months to propagate throughout the substrate. Mushroom farmers develop a love-hate relationship with these high-quality winter shiitake, because while they generate big revenues, they require meticulous care. https://www.taiwan-panorama.com/Articles/Details?Guid=4c1e342e-1492-46b9-84b2-8bd9feb65fa2&CatId=1 ------------------------------------------------------- Editor: << I see two different different meanings for 冬菇 in different sources, never both on the same source: 1) Any kind of mushroom (菇类 — not a specific species) gathered or produced in the winter. MoE mentions “香菇、洋菇、草菇”, etc. all can be 冬菇. (Pleco; GF; MoE; LAC. ABC's “winter mushrooms” also points in this direction).>> I disagree. a) GF says it's a *shiitake* (not "any mushroom") harvested in the winter. b) The fact that LAC says 富含蛋白质及多种人体必需微量元素 suggests to me that they are trying to indicate that it's not just any mushroom picked or produced in winter. Are *all* mushrooms picked in the winter high in protein and trace elements? c) Even MoE, which does mention other types of mushroom, gives as its example a sentence where 冬菇 refers specifically to shiitake mushrooms grown in winter. d) ABC's definition was most likely derived from another source, probably some version of ACE/Pleco. I wouldn't be surprised if they just reworded something like Pleco's definition. << 2) Synonym for 香菇, shiitake (百度百科，Wikipedia, 现代汉语大词典).>> I think you are drawing a false conclusion from your Wikipedia quote: 香菇（学名：Lentinula edodes）又叫做冬菇... I don't think you should assume from this statement that both 香菇 and 冬菇 mean *exactly* the same thing. And if you look elsewhere in Wikipedia, you will find that they say that 冬菇 is not a general term for shiitake but rather a specific type of shiitake: a) One type of high-grade shiitake is called donko (冬菇) in Japanese and dōnggū in Chinese, literally "winter mushroom". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shiitake#Uses b) 香菇的種類 香菇品種...依生產季節又分為春菇、夏菇、秋菇、冬菇， https://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E9%A6%99%E8%8F%87#%E9%A6%99%E8%8F%87%E7%9A%84%E7%A8%AE%E9%A1%9E Your Taiwan Panorama quotes are consistent with the notion that 冬菇 refers to donko shiitake. Indeed, in the last quote, the translation indicates that 冬菇 is "winter shiitake" rather than just "shiitake". Wiktionary's definition: 冬菇 : a type of shiitake mushroom; Etymology: Literally "winter mushroom"; shiitake growing in colder weather are supposed to be more flavorful. "In Japan, there are two general types of Shiitake mushrooms including the donko (冬菇), which is a highly valued mushroom that is more round with thick flesh and the koshin, which is a mushroom with a thinner flesh and an open cap. Donko Shiitake mushrooms are prized for their medicinal value as the cap is only partially open and retains more of the spores." https://www.specialtyproduce.com/produce/Shiitake_Mushrooms_701.php 冬菇 (どんこ) a thick-fleshed shiitake mushroom of which the cap is only partly opened; a donko shiitake. [Kenkyusha's New Japanese-English Dictionary] "Especially "Donko" is a type of dried Shiitake which grows gradually during winter and gets thicker." https://ichibajunction.com.au/products/detail.php?product_id=998006861 Type of Shiitake Please choose depending on it what you cook. DONKO - Growing slowly during a cold winter from late winter to early spring (from February to March). The harvest time is before the pileus opens 70%. KOKO - [appears to be a particular type of donko, just larger and thicker] KOSHIN - Growing from middle spring to late spring (from middle March to April). The harvest time is when the pileus opens 70%. http://www.osk-shiitake.or.jp/en/type/ "The variety of shiitake called donko, are superior in both flavour and medicinal qualities to the variety called koshin. In their natural effort at self-preservation, donko shiitake produce a thick cap with strong viable spores to protect against harsh environmental conditions. [...] These cost more but are prized for their excellent flavour and healthfulness." https://www.clearspring.co.uk/blogs/news/10227637-shiitake-miracle-mushrooms I think this all points to the conclusion that 冬菇 can refer to a specific type of shiitake, the donko shiitake. And it seems that this may be the usual meaning. It seems it is a highly prized kind, so you could say it's a high-grade shiitake, but it doesn't *mean* "high-grade shiitake". I'm not so sure it's worth mentioning the possibility that it might also refer to any mushroom grown in the winter. Let me know if you have more evidence of that. |
| Diff: |
- 冬菇 冬菇 [dong1 gu1] /grade of Shiitake mushroom (Lentinula edodes)/ # + 冬菇 冬菇 [dong1 gu1] /mushroom picked or produced in the winter/specifically shiitake mushroom (Lentinula edodes)/ + 冬菇 冬菇 [dong1 gu1] /donko shiitake mushroom, a prized type of shiitake (Lentinula edodes) cultivated in winter, with thick flesh and partially open cap/ |